[DRIVING] 1984 Voltswagen Rabbit Prius Gen 3 ZOMBIE

[Gregski]

I was going to use the start position of my ignition switch to enable drive, but in my car the Ign pos 1 and 2 are disconnected from the battery when I do. Probably to ensure the starter gets 100% of battery power but I was disappointed when I discovered this as it caused issues else where.
It's not ideal but drive is enabled as soon as I turn to pos 2.

But I'm not using Zombie so I'm missing a lot of the benefits of it.

Interesting, do you think the Freelander has something like an X-Relay circuit in it, which cripples ancillaries whilst starting?

[Alibro]

I think it is just part of the ignition switch that disconnects everything except the starter and whatever other part of the ECU etc required for the car to start. I already had the VCU and other parts of the LV junction box connected to Ign pos 1 and 2 when I realised.

[MattsAwesomeStuff]

ZombieVerter VCU Wont RUN

A hunch...

When autorefresh is on, the search bar refreshes faster than you can get to the 2nd search item.

I've come across a few things like that, that seemed like they were broken or unresponsive, and it was just the auto-refresh.

...

On variable names, I'm onboard with you. They're programmer-friendly for anyone editing the code perhaps, but not user-friendly.

Short variable names are perhaps useful when using the interface to send commands directly. "Set udcsw 330" or whatnot on the command line. But for anyone reading them, yeah, challenging.

On Johannes not listening... Johannes has already cleaned up Damien's variable names at least once in the past, just for consistency's sake for capitalization nomenclature and all that, and gave a lecture on why it's important. Seems to not have stuck perhaps

And like any system, it now has momentum behind it.

I'd settle for a questionmark or a hover bubble next to each variable name where you could click on it and it brings up the help/info on that specfiic parameter. Last I went through this, even many of main parameters had no description or documentation about what they are and how you'd use them.

I was thinking about documentation having like, beginner, intermediate, and advanced use for each parameter.

But like most of my ideas on documentation, you have to understand something really well in order to document it well, especially at a structural stage, and I don't have the depth of knowledge to followthrough on any of the documentation redesign I get half way through suggesting.

This leaves the inevitable curse of open source... anyone who can figure it out doesn't need to document it, and anyone who can't figure it out can't document it. So, nothing is ever thoroughly documented. :p

[Gregski]

A hunch...

When autorefresh is on, the search bar refreshes faster than you can get to the 2nd search item.

I've come across a few things like that, that seemed like they were broken or unresponsive, and it was just the auto-refresh.

...

On variable names, I'm onboard with you. They're programmer-friendly for anyone editing the code perhaps, but not user-friendly.

Short variable names are perhaps useful when using the interface to send commands directly. "Set udcsw 330" or whatnot on the command line. But for anyone reading them, yeah, challenging.

On Johannes not listening... Johannes has already cleaned up Damien's variable names at least once in the past, just for consistency's sake for capitalization nomenclature and all that, and gave a lecture on why it's important. Seems to not have stuck perhaps

And like any system, it now has momentum behind it.

I'd settle for a questionmark or a hover bubble next to each variable name where you could click on it and it brings up the help/info on that specfiic parameter. Last I went through this, even many of main parameters had no description or documentation about what they are and how you'd use them.

I was thinking about documentation having like, beginner, intermediate, and advanced use for each parameter.

But like most of my ideas on documentation, you have to understand something really well in order to document it well, especially at a structural stage, and I don't have the depth of knowledge to followthrough on any of the documentation redesign I get half way through suggesting.

I could not have said it better myself, and this last part I tried to quote you on many a times before but I could not find or remember where I first read you say that (read you say that??? yeah it's now a thing)

This leaves the inevitable curse of open source... anyone who can figure it out doesn't need to document it, and anyone who can't figure it out can't document it. So, nothing is ever thoroughly documented. :p

strength in numbers folks Strength In Numbers !!!

[Gregski]

84 VW MK1 Rabbit DIY Wire Harness Fuse Block & BMW Safety Box Part 1





What is he up to now?

[jrbe]

This leaves the inevitable curse of open source... anyone who can figure it out doesn't need to document it, and anyone who can't figure it out can't document it. So, nothing is ever thoroughly documented. :p

strength in numbers folks Strength In Numbers !!!

I don't want to get too off topic, but while you guys are chatting about documentation I wanted to throw an Idea into the ring.

I believe ai is perfectly suited for digging through tons of text and pulling out pertinent info to put documentation together. I've been pretty impressed with claude.ai specifically. I haven't tried yet but I think Claude can do this well. It should help with giving the documentation 1 voice and should also be able to translate it to different languages.
I'll stop there. If you guys want to pursue this and want to start another thread about this please tag me in it.

[uhi22]

Done viewtopic.php?t=4980

[Gregski]

84 VW MK1 Rabbit DIY Wire Harness Fuse Block & BMW Safety Box 2






below the bench power supply on the right is simulating the High Voltage battery pack

[MattsAwesomeStuff]

84 VW MK1 Rabbit DIY Wire Harness Fuse Block & BMW Safety Box 2 What's going on here, isn't the light bulb the same as a capacitor?

Just taking a swing...

A capacitor is a load, yes. But when it charges up it stays charged.

A light bulb is also a load, but it is continuous. So it's constantly draining the power.

Since you don't actually have a capacitor hooked up, there's no energy reserve. Maybe when your relay toggles, that moment between, the voltage drops and throws the error?

[Gregski]

Just taking a swing...

A capacitor is a load, yes. But when it charges up it stays charged.

A light bulb is also a load, but it is continuous. So it's constantly draining the power.

Since you don't actually have a capacitor hooked up, there's no energy reserve. Maybe when your relay toggles, that moment between, the voltage drops and throws the error?

Thanks Matt, per a commentors suggestion I tried lowering the udcsw to 35 volts and that worked, someday I will understand all this but today is not that day

[Gregski]

ZombieVerter VCU Throttle Calibration

[MattsAwesomeStuff]

"Digits" I think is, maybe a poor translation, based on Johannes' feedback to me a few years ago.

In English, digits means how many orders of magnitude. Like, 5927 is 4 digits. 218 is 3 digits. How many columns the number takes up.

"Units" might be a closer meaning.

For example, there are some variables that vary between 0 and 4095. If a variable is currently at 500... that's 500 of what? It doesn't have a unit, (amps, volts, ohms, etc), so its unit... is units.

You can think of it like a percentage, if the percentage went from 0-4095 instead of 0-100. It's a unitless number.

I've never heard anyone describe that in English as "digits", though, I'm only an engineering dropout, so, maybe I'm missing something.

[P.S.Mangelsdorf]

It's a unitless number.

That's how my engineering professors would have described it.

A unitless integer with a range from 0 to whatever.

[Gregski]

That's how my engineering professors would have described it.

A unitless integer with a range from 0 to whatever.

man just when I thought I knew nothing, you remind me that I know even less !

[mane2]

How about "Reference Voltage"?

[Gregski]

How about "Reference Voltage"?

talk to me Goose.jpg (11.22 KiB) Viewed 11021 times

[P.S.Mangelsdorf]

man just when I thought I knew nothing, you remind me that I know even less !

Oh let's not pretend I know anything either!

[arber333]

man just when I thought I knew nothing, you remind me that I know even less !

Well nice job with the video...
It is all about sensor resolution. 0 to 4095 means your sensor can see in 12bit increments. 12bit is greater parts than 10bit. This means your full sensor resolution is divided into 4095 indivdual parts which are referenced by the chip Aref pin. This pin wil see the full value from 0 to Vref (can be 3V3 on some chips and 5V on others...) so thats your analog sensor input pin can comfortably divide its 12bit array to 4095 of same pieces of cake.
When you move thottle your analog pin will see changes in voltage but its comparator will see how many of those parts you ran through with voltage . Those parts will turn from 0 to 1 and this will mean something which was predetermined in code. Normally result is in % throttle, but it could be in Nm of torque or CAN bus command etc...

When you calibrate throttle you set the area within those 4095 parts where throttle is active. For example if you use 5V reference, but your throttle can only show from 0.8V to 4.2V you calibrate that area with some overhead to eliminate jumpiness. Say calibrate from 0.85V to 3.99V. This will then mean 0 to 100% throttle motion, everything else will be ignored. This may mean you cant utilize full 4095 pieces of cake but only 3200. Still it is plenty enough for detecting throttle changes.

[MattsAwesomeStuff]

from 0.8V to 4.2V you calibrate that area with some overhead to eliminate jumpiness. Say calibrate from 0.85V to 3.99V. This will then mean 0 to 100% throttle motion, everything else will be ignored.

In the original setup documentation, the notes say that you're supposed to calibrate the throttle to be a "little less than, and a little more than" the actual measurements.

And I asked, and got no reply, as to whether that should've been smaller net range or larger net range. The wording was ambiguous, like saying "Traffic lights tell you whether to stop or go", yes but WHICH tells you to stop and which tells you to go? You haven't delivered the critical piece of information. The throttle should be a little less and a little more. Okay, but in what way?

If throttle was 1.0v to 4.0v ... do I set it to 0.9v-4.1v? Or do I set it to 1.1v-3.9v? Greg shows we narrow the net range, so the latter.

My concern here, several years ago, based on what Arber said, was... in what way does it ignore it? Like, if my pedal is 1.0v to 4.0v ... and I set it 1.1v to 3.9v ... what happens when I put the pedal to the metal? What happens when I cross past 3.9v? Does my throttle suddenly die because I bottomed it out at 4.0v?

Do I actually set the throttle like a parallelegram, 1.1v to 4.1v?

Like, these questions all have answers, but again it relates to the trouble of documentation written for equals, or documentation written for people who know less than you. So much open source documentation is written for equals, as light reminders. When, to be useful, it needs to be written for people who would merely use the project, not people who could've developed it themselves.

[arber333]

...
If throttle was 1.0v to 4.0v ... do I set it to 0.9v-4.1v? Or do I set it to 1.1v-3.9v? Greg shows we narrow the net range, so the latter.

If the program in the VCU is set correctly you cant calibrate lesser value than your sensor is showing. You are seeing 0.8V low and 4.2 full and you cant measure 0.6V unless you do something directly to the sensor circuit. When you calibrate you put your foot on the pedal only slightly so you show VCU where your preset 0% is Not natural 0 but preset 0!
Then you push the pedal full and show VCU where the 100% is set. Because of pedal geometry this could be less than 4.2V but never more since the op amp inside the pedal can only go so far.

My concern here, several years ago, based on what Arber said, was... in what way does it ignore it? Like, if my pedal is 1.0v to 4.0v ... and I set it 1.1v to 3.9v ... what happens when I put the pedal to the metal? What happens when I cross past 3.9v? Does my throttle suddenly die because I bottomed it out at 4.0v?

When you go past 3.9V with full throttle analog sensor will still read say 4030 value but since you set the limits by calibrating code then 100% value ends with 3.9V or translated 3980 into 12bit pieces. VCU will know you are past the value but will only output up to the 100% value. An equivalent of mechanical door stop if you will.

Do I actually set the throttle like a parallelegram, 1.1v to 4.1v?

I have throttle reading set at 1.6V to 4.0V in my Mazda just because pedal geometry works that way. And it still works good.
The way Aot93 programmed VCU is to take motor RPM and pedal position and produce torque request. This means my throttle position is made of only 21 pices of cake!!! And it still works rather well.

[Gregski]

Well nice job with the video...
It is all about sensor resolution. 0 to 4095 means your sensor can see in 12bit increments. 12bit is greater parts than 10bit. This means your full sensor resolution is divided into 4095 indivdual parts which are referenced by the chip Aref pin. This pin wil see the full value from 0 to Vref (can be 3V3 on some chips and 5V on others...) so thats your analog sensor input pin can comfortably divide its 12bit array to 4095 of same pieces of cake.
When you move thottle your analog pin will see changes in voltage but its comparator will see how many of those parts you ran through with voltage . Those parts will turn from 0 to 1 and this will mean something which was predetermined in code. Normally result is in % throttle, but it could be in Nm of torque or CAN bus command etc...

When you calibrate throttle you set the area within those 4095 parts where throttle is active. For example if you use 5V reference, but your throttle can only show from 0.8V to 4.2V you calibrate that area with some overhead to eliminate jumpiness. Say calibrate from 0.85V to 3.99V. This will then mean 0 to 100% throttle motion, everything else will be ignored. This may mean you cant utilize full 4095 pieces of cake but only 3200. Still it is plenty enough for detecting throttle changes.

[Gregski]

sometimes you're allowed to have a little fun

[Gregski]

introducing the latest line to our Wood-A-Bility series

[Gregski]

I had so much fun making this...

[Gregski]