openinverter forum

I plan on using the Prius C (Aqua here in NZ - jap imports) transaxle and inverter in a Mini conversion. I've just obtained a wrecked Aqua, delivered today. Cost me $2k, but turns out some parts are sought after, already sold rear bumper and lights online for $400, so that helps to keep the wife happy! I'm hoping to use it in dual motor mode, so just looking at getting pcbs ordered - as far as I can tell, Damien doesn't have the dual motor version for sale on evbmw. I'll start a new thread for dual motor Prius C and transaxle, once I have progressed enough to have something useful to share

@ bjp
I have a couple of new dual motor boards auris need building but would seriously consider v1c single board with the jumpers soldered powering both as a simpler option

I have a running system in my boat with Toyota Auris Inverter boosting my 48v battery pack voltage into the Leaf em57 motor, but I'm only able to get 3kw out of it. Have tried boosting in the range of 120V to 300V but that does not change real output much. Everything runs smooth and nicely, but expected to get more juice. At 3kw motor has around 1000rpm. Afaik the Auris inverter should be able to tackle up to 200 amps so should be able to get me close to 10kw. Any ideas?

glink wrote: ↑Wed Aug 03, 2022 6:40 pm Afaik the Auris inverter should be able to tackle up to 200 amps so should be able to get me close to 10kw. Any ideas?

The voltage is just very low, boosting amperage is limited and there are loses. You can try paralleling output from both Mg2 and Mg1 for extra amps (solder up the jumpers on the control board and then join power stage outputs togetger). If that don't help much see if you can rearrange your battery to up the voltage.

Thanks, thought it was the buck-boost hw that might be limiting the amps? Around 60 amps only.

Hi, I haven't measured anything, and am only getting stuck into my EV Mini project, using the Aqua (Prius C) Gen 3 inverter and transaxle, but from researching available info, I've come to the conclusion that the limit on the HV boost module might be around 15-19kW, with input of around 144V (nominal battery pack voltage). So the input current limit might be around 100-120A (give or take)?

This is simply inferred from the information here for the P510 motor/transmission:
https://toyota-club.net/files/faq/21-12 ... n.htm#P510
total max power = 73kW
I.C.E. max power = 54kW
therefore max. batt. power = 19kW

and here from the table on battery capacity:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive
Prius battery = 1.3kWh NiMh (28 modules, 201.6V), max. power output = 21kW
Prius C battery = 0.9 kWh NiMH (20 modules, 144V nom, 162V max?), max. output power inferred = 15kW

Under what parameters have you tested it? Able to load it up more to try and see if it will pull more amps under high loads at same speed?

I'm having trouble spinning a motor in open loop mode with a block III board. I'm pretty much just following the steps I did for the gen 3 prius setup I've got in the car.

The gate driver pwm signals are present when probed in manual mode. I've tried various firmware versions. I've probably missed something silly or have a dead inverter.

Any ideas to try/debug?

Do you have the capacitor pack connected?

When I first powered mine up I didn't and it took a while to realise that you need different HV bus connections without it.

Yea, cap is on. Got 44v battery connected.

2nd inverter also not spinning the motor. I must be doing something wrong.
EDIT Does the PWM look ok? I don't think 0 to -0.1 looks right?

Assume that is on a phase output with the ground on battery 0v? In that case no it doesn't look right but it is encouraging that there is something there.

Any more details/pics of how you have it connected/wired up?

Assuming that you are running the HV at a low, safe voltage I'd be inclined to run it without the cap pack so that the board is accessible for testing. Without a motor connected check that all the power rails from the logic board to the IGBT board are right and also check the pwm waveforms to the igbt board. If they are all correct look at the main phase outputs, if everything is right you should see a square wave at the full pack voltage with varying duty cycle. Even without the main cap pack there are still a couple of caps on the HV bus bar (one in the middle and one on the far end) so it should be safe to also try running a motor without the cap pack connected but keep the currents low (say 10-20A).

This is the driver signal. There's nothing on the phase outputs. Got a 44v battery hooked up to HV.
Probed each via in turn and the gnd attached to the 12v gnd. Using a sine version firmware I know works 4.94, starting the inverter in manual mode, the noise starts as expected, set ampnom to 100 and fslipsnpnt to 10 then probed.

I did notice on my Prius inverter that when in the fault state the igbt board turns off the supply to the pwm input pullups (effectively disabling them). Could that fit with what you see?

The pwm signal into the board should normally be a few volts (think the pull up is to 5v).

Don't understand what the noise is if there is no PWM?

Edit - have you checked all the 5v and 12v supplies to the igbt board are ok?

Not sure where to probe on the IGBT board. I've checked the voltages on the logic board, those are still good.
There's PWM at the transistors, though voltage is pretty low.
Double checked the IGBT connector soldering, that looks good.

On the base of the transistors you should see a square wave between 0v and around 0.6v. On the collector is should be a few volts.

If you can see 5v/12v on the igbt board side connector pins it should be ok.

Could the pwm transistors be the issue, duff or incorrect parts? Do you have any way to test them (should be possible to check with a multimeter in diode test mode)?

Edit - still don't understand noise without pwm, you must have pwm if you can hear the inverter whine?

Edit2 - what do you see on the other side of the collector resistor (or connector pin)?

The IGBT connector looked fine under magnification, but I hit it again with the heat. Now have spinning in Sine mode, so can play this weekend with the auto tune branch Now got a spare inverter

Guess it was a poor joint on whichever connector pin supplies the pwm optos?

Must have been. I guess the general rule for the Toyota boards, if in doubt it's the white connector.

todays issues:
UDC stays at 280 so need to debug that, maybe the white connector again.
il1 and il2 always read 0, as its a block iii board, I opted to cut the sensor wires to flip them, instead of destroying the connector housing.

Still progress though.

I've never had much luck soldering connectors like the white one with hot air, too cool and it doesn't solder properly, too hot and it turns crispy/melts with very little margin in between. I've had much more success with a decent fine tipped soldering iron and a magnifying glass!

That's what I've done.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/W2f754nxyLcVPxQB9
All looks good, so not sure what could be the issue now. Will have to poke around more tomorrow.

So, I've probed the pins on MG1 and MG2 current sensors on my Block iii board, the 26V, -5V and 5V pins are in exactly the same position, I'm thinking this version of the board has the current sensor pinout fixed, contrary to the wiki. Will confirm and update is this is the case.

Still slogging away, so block III does indeed have the current sensors the correct way round, so no mods needed. I'm now able to spin the motor with manual Id (on old firmware) I've followed FOC tuning and I have an offset value that's pretty close I think.
Starting in normal mode and giving a little bit of throttle the motor starts to spin, letting go of the throttle is continues to spin and then speeds up a little and maintains that speed. So I think I'm still a little off on the offset. So getting there.

The UDC issue remains, I've checked the resistors match the schematic, the pin on the white connector is good, the param values are the same as on my prius inverter. I get the same value with the same board in 2 different inverters.

I believe I need UDC working properly to test Pete's auto tune, but still got to get the manual tune offset confirmed before running auto tune to see if they come close.

https://github.com/damienmaguire/Yaris- ... ematic.pdf

Bigpie wrote: ↑Tue Jul 11, 2023 5:32 pm I believe I need UDC working properly to test Pete's auto tune, but still got to get the manual tune offset confirmed before running auto tune to see if they come close.

It just uses udc to estimate the starting pwm value so if udc is under reading it will use too big a pwm value to start with and trip on over current. In your case udc is over reading so it will start with too small a pwm value and then ramp up, with the smaller value it may or may not manage to get enough current flowing to make the measureemnt.

To just try out the auto setup you could temorarily adjust the udc gain and offset to get udc reading in the right ballpark for the pack voltage being used?

I'll give that a go if I don't figure it out soon.