56 Chevy Nomad hotrod

[BeNimble]

I have a 56 Nomad EV project. It have a very low budget but want to make it as fast as possible.
The car is actually starting out as a 56 4-door wagon that I am modifying to look like a Nomad, as I have a real one and will make fiberglass parts from it, the specific nomad parts are the roof and rear quarters and tailgate, but I will likely make the whole car body parts in fiberglass.
I will be fabricating a tube chassis for it.

It will be AWD. I have a 2012 Leaf that will be used for the FWD power, and a C6 corvette front suspension.
I have a Corvette C6 rear suspension with the C6 differential. It has a 2.73 gear ratio, which is a challenge. A 4:11 gear is available, but expensive.
I'm trying to decide which motor(s) to put in the back. I need about 400hp back there.
The C6 differential is unique in that its input shaft passes through the pinion gear, so you can actually attach a motor to the front and back of the diff with the shaft. So I am thinking of using two motors, one optimized for acceleration for 0-60 times to beat a Tesla, and the other for high speed passing the LS swapped cars in the straights. I was thinking another leaf motor for the high speed. For the drag motor, I want a two-speed transmission, and was looking into a powerglide or other options. But now I am thinking of using the GS450H L110 motor, as it has a two-speed planetary in the tailshaft, as I understand it has a 2:1 and 4:1 gearing. Was also thinking removing the MG1 and bellhousing, leaving just the MG2.

Another idea is to use a 5.5:1 open differential (I have a 9in ford diff already) where the motor is input to the pinion, and the right wheel output feds the C5 diff. I lock the left side wheel output to get a 2.76:1 gear and at top speed unlock it so the motor won't spin. This would also let me mount the rear motor transverse to the rearend.

Any feedback or suggestions are appreciated. I've built 3 EVs (FIero, Boxster, and totally custom IndyOne 3wheeler), this time I want a real hotrod that I can daily drive and also take to the track.

Here are some pics of what I'm starting with and what I want to end up with..note that green car is shortened and chopped and sectioned..or should say the pretty green car. The ugly green car is also somewhat chopped..lol

[BeNimble]

Another consideration is I have a few gen1 prius transaxles. I want to use the junk I have if possible.
Taking one and removing everything but the mg2 and the planet, lock the mg1, and then I can use the ICE input shaft as the output and have a 1.2:1 gear. The gen1 prius motor looks to me like a more powerful motor that is limited by its inverter.
Which cheap inverters are a good choice for high power? There are a couple model3 motors/inverters for like $500 locally. They seem to want a lot for the model s motors.

[Aragorn]

If you really want 400hp, you need to start with a motor designed around those sorts of power levels... Trying to lash up a Prius motor when you have a goal for 400hp doesnt make any sense, when those motors make not even half that.

I also dont see the point of keeping the C6 diff and trying to add loads of complexity and weight... You need a rear drive unit thats capable of 400hp. Which probably means one of the Tesla units as while others exist, theres not much in the way of aftermarket for them.

Apply KISS.

Trying to be cheap, but in the process spending hundreds of hours designing all sorts of custom contraptions isnt really cheap any more. Given your replacing all the suspension anyway, i'd be pulling the entire rear end out of a Tesla. Subframe, drive unit, control arms, spindles, brakes etc. Someone else has already done the complicated bits, and done them to OEM standard.

[BeNimble]

I want to go faster than a Tesla and take corners like a C6 Corvette...and have a budget like a Canadian.

I think two 300 hp motors are going to be easier than one 600hp. I said 400hp, but that is minimum, really want 600hp.

Was looking into a Chevy Volt inverter, it has two motor drivers, each one specs at 650v and 1000amps says Professor Kelly. I believe the Volt pack can deliver 850amps, I have one of those already. Does not seem anyone has used one of these inverters. I see one for sale at $100, I think I may just buy it and see what I can figure out from it, does Mr. Baer want to figure it out?

But I need to get this car built using the Leaf first, which is the KISS part.

[P.S.Mangelsdorf]

I think you'll regret the over complication here, and will end up spending more than a couple of Tesla units. An LDU out back and an SDU or even another LDU up front will be far less complex to set up and achieve your performance goals.

I will say the Volt inverter idea has some merit - I had thought about using one to run two Leaf motors, or two to run four on some future project.

[BeNimble]

There is something I regret already...not a single "that's cool" for what I think is the coolest project ever. oh well, wrong crowd I guess.

The original idea was a motor to each rear wheel to get torque vectoring. So going with a single differential is already the simpler plan.

I don't see how I can spend more when I'm spending nothing by using stuff I already have. I have a couple DC motors, 3 or 4 gen1 and gen2 prius transaxles and inverters, more than a couple differentials. I also have couple highlander transaxles.
In any case, a GS450H motor I can get for $270, or a model 3 rdu for $500, these are still cheap.
What gets real expensive are aftermarket products that make conversions "easier" for those with $20k+ budgets.
If I was in business to build EVs, then you can't wait and shop around for deals, and "easier" is the only way to stay in business and get your $50k customers. I only ever work on my own projects, I have 12 cars at the moment.

My running leaf was $400 with a 37 mile pack. The smashed 56 was $300. My volt pack was $500. My C6 parts were $400. I already have lots of 1.5 tubing, the wheels shown in my photoshopped nomad, including fat dot drag tires.

The thought is using gears to not fight back emf. Instead of using a volt pack at 360v and 850amps, 180v and 1700 amps (or so, just have to see)
Moreover, daily driving I don't even need the rear motors to be spinning at all. I think porsche uses a 2 speed gear for a reason, and why the L110 has a two speed in it. See https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2890 ... nsmission/

But yes for a first EV going simple is what I'd advice also. I've been there done that. I just poked fun at Aging Wheels who is trying to build a "900hp Escape" as his first EV build.

[Bratitude]

There is something I regret already...not a single "that's cool" for what I think is the coolest project ever. oh well, wrong crowd I guess.

lots of people come and go with grand ideas that are ill thought out, and then to never be seen or heard of again. there is a reason why every one that wants power uses a tesla drive unit.

power, simple, cheap.

pick 2.

there are no exceptions.

2 m3 DUs for 1000$ cad is a crazy deal, where abouts are you located?

[P.S.Mangelsdorf]

Look, I think the car's cool, and I think any AWD performance EV hot rod is cool. But if you're talking about trying to beat Corvettes, a pile of mild hybrid parts are going to be thousands of hours more work, and figuring out all the adapters and connections you're talking about, much less controlling, is going to take a bunch of material, time, and cost.

I too hate when people crap on someone's idea that they find cool. And I think others here will attest that I'm usually the overly positive one trying to police some of the natural pessimism that creeps up on forums. But to your own point, you've done a few conversions. So you're not a newbie we're chasing off, we're just trying to bring some other perspective to an idea that is a bit out there. If you can make all that work, by all means have at it, I'd love to watch it happen and see what you come up with. But as Bratitude said, there's a reason everyone currently uses Tesla stuff for performance applications - it works for a reasonable price, especially if you use OI control rather than commercial options.

[BeNimble]

Thought I'd give an update.

I acquired two gen1 leaf motors for the rear drive of the Nomad, which i think now I'm calling it the MadC6 project.
I acquired a 2008 Corvette C6 rolling chassis, could not resist at the price point of $500.
Also acquired 3 Volt motor inverters from the picknpull which are $85 each. So now I can use one for each leaf motor.
And an essentially new 2024 Model 3 pack, the short 4ft long modules for $1600, just can't beat the energy density.
I'm wondering if these tesla battery modules can be mounted on their side. Seems this might be an issue, but then again the cells are packed in pretty tight and filled with the thermal xfer material. The C6 has a center tunnel that could hold two of them sideways. The floor can only fit two of them. I could cut away the center tunnel, then fit all four on the floor. Or I could use just two of the modules on the floor, the Volt modules will fit into the tunnel it looks like with a tape measure.

The pursuit of a two speed and disconnect for the rear motors...modifying a rear diff, turns out chevy is just as smart as I am, and already does this for awd trucks, they have a mechanism to allow one side to be either locked or unlocked to the axle, so in rwd mode, one side of the diff disconnects and freewheels, and in awd mode, they lock that side to the axle, Imagine that. But I came up with a better idea, using a 4wd transfer case.
I picked up a chevy truck unit to test, it has 4 modes, 2wd high, 4wd high, 4wd low with 2.73:1 gear, and neutral.
Because it uses a planetary gear and aluminum case, it is relatively light. No need for the chain or the 4wd engagement. So stripped down, I get neutral (motor disconnect from rear diff), a 2.73:1 gear ratio, and a 1:1 gear ratio. With the 2.79:1 rear diff, in low, it's a 7.5:1 to the rear wheels. Electronic controlled.
I could keep the chain to shorten the length of it all, I will just have to see if the extra parts and weight is worth it.

The one thing many might be interested in is a coupler for the Leaf motors. I confirmed that a "shaft holding tool" for a Yamaha jetski using a 22mm-20spline coupler and it fits perfectly to the leaf shaft. Part number is WR014H, amazon sell them $15 (but don't buy from amazon, boycott them..)
I bought a couple from a watersports outfit,
https://www.atlanticjetsports.com/produ ... 6307&_ss=r

[BeNimble]

I guess I'd also add that I've chopped all the body parts off the rusted smashed 4 door, that car was about as bad as they get, but it did have a few good parts. I'm driving the 450 miles to southern california from sacramento to get a pair of 2-door hardtop fiberglass "race" doors. Shipping on anything this large is insane, I also got a 56 chevy windshield for $25, was only a 60 mile drive for that one.

Also the Volt motor controller has already been "reverse engineered", there is info on github about them.
Turns out it has a simple interface to the power units, just throw away the general control board that manages all the volt transmission/motors.
And btw, I am still considering using a volt transmission or maybe a pair of them, as they also have two gear ratios and a neutral controlled by hydraulic clutch plates. If you replace the gas motor with a leaf motor...the input shaft from the gas motor however looks pretty weak.

I'd also add that I've been building custom cars for since I was 17 my first one was a 59 Anglia with a toyota truck drivetrain.
the LoFlyer 63 Falcon frame-up racecar with a unique 506 stroker I designed, the full custom 71 Midget MGEO, the IndyOne three wheel EV.
I'm also trying to finish the "Angry Echo" which is now in my shop, a 2000 toyota echo stripped into a 3 wheel "slingshot wannabe".
Still need to finish its cage and some bodywork on it. The MadC6 is my priority, as it will be my daily driver, the Angry Echo was going to be my 32 mile one-way commute to my shop, but this will now be the MadC6, so this project WILL be finished, I am "retired" and don't work for anyone but myself.

[Bratitude]

The one thing many might be interested in is a coupler for the Leaf motors. I confirmed that a "shaft holding tool" for a Yamaha jetski using a 22mm-20spline coupler and it fits perfectly to the leaf shaft. Part number is WR014H, amazon sell them $15 (but don't buy from amazon, boycott them..)
I bought a couple from a watersports outfit,
https://www.atlanticjetsports.com/produ ... 6307&_ss=r

LeafCoupler.jpg

I have heard 2 things:
-the fit is actually pretty loose
-the material is quite cheap and will strip very quickly


I have dedicated leaf couplers, made from 4140 steel, with a very tight fit.. as there is nothing available other than the original input shaft

[muehlpower]

Is there something new, or have we spoiled you? You've done a good job on the Nomad. Is your project going to be based on the Nomad or the C6? Or something of your own? Your initial description was a bit overwhelming and didn't seem to me to be the final concept.