Hi Guys,
I am looking at a project to convert a JDM Toyota Alphard Hybrid (ATH20) to electric. From the research that I have done, it looks like the front uses 2JM with a p311, and rear motor is 2FM. It seems to share the same system as the camry AHV40 / Estima AHR20W. Please correct me if I am wrong on this.
A little background, I have actually been retrofitting Land Cruiser 70 series for safari use but for those I just ditch the engine and put an electric motor on the gearbox ( A mix of curtis and SME/Hyper systems) but for this project, it seems more feasible to just remove the hybrid engine and increase battery capacity to have a fully electric Alphard.
I have been browsing the Prius gen 3 board forums and a couple others where the camry/lexus/estima systems are mentioned and just wanted feedback about this project to start with. I will have a running Alphard ATH20 Hybrid so if we need to check wiring, power and communication of the OEM systems can be done before removing the engine and installing openinverter.
I know openinverter is not a plug and play system (such as the curtis and SME inverters we have been using). But we are ready to do R&D for the Alphard Hybrid system as it is worth it.
Toyota Alphard ATH20W Hybrid to Electric.
Re: Toyota Alphard ATH20W Hybrid to Electric.
After some more research, and going through more threads again, I believe the ATH20W shares the same / similar 3-in-1 inverter P/N G9200-28011 (G92A0 depending on the region) and 28011 or 28012. I am just trying to collect as much data as possible right now for the work ahead.
What would I need to potentially start sniffing the comms (toyota sync serial) from the running car? DSLogic will work? (I will need to purchase it). I Also have a canable pro for reading canbus data as well as a MVCI/J2534 OBD with toyota techstream.
From what I can see, the ATH20W has an EV-Only mode, which I plan to capture the data with and then hopefully we can be able to get the zombieverter VCU to work with the toyota sync serial from the captured data.
What would I need to potentially start sniffing the comms (toyota sync serial) from the running car? DSLogic will work? (I will need to purchase it). I Also have a canable pro for reading canbus data as well as a MVCI/J2534 OBD with toyota techstream.
From what I can see, the ATH20W has an EV-Only mode, which I plan to capture the data with and then hopefully we can be able to get the zombieverter VCU to work with the toyota sync serial from the captured data.
Re: Toyota Alphard ATH20W Hybrid to Electric.
Hi @neelkanth, I'm currently plotting a similar project, although I don't yet own an Alphard - currently looking for one at a suitable price that I don't mind hacking it about, perhaps with a sick hybrid battery. I don't plan to remove the engine, just make it a PHEV.
I currently own a Gen2 Prius and a Yaris Hybrid (Euro version of the Prius C, similar hybrid as the Gen3 Prius) and I've been CAN sniffing with an OBDLink-SX USB cable I happened to have (speaks ELM327 protocol but at 2Mbps, unlike the ELM327 clone dongles), the Linux SocketCAN stack and SavvyCAN. In the Gen2 there's only one canbus and then battery ECU sits at the end of it, so it's all accessible from the OBD port. I can see battery ECU messages about SoC etc. I also have a clone Mini-VCI cable for TechStream but I couldn't convince Linux CAN to talk to it - possibly the fakes work different to the real thing.
On PriusChat there are a few folks who have made replacements for the battery ECU (Battery Support Unit or BSU) so an alternative battery can be fitted and generating the same CAN messages. That's stage 1 of my plan. Also there is somebody who put a man in the middle between the hybrid ECU and the engine ECU and could tell the engine to shut off and run the car in EV mode up to 70mph. On the Gen3 they say that's harder because that function is integrated into the inverter, although there appears to still be an engine ECU so maybe that can be tapped. Unfortunately none of those projects are open source that I can see.
As I don't have an Alphard yet I don't have good ideas about packaging, but I'm looking at the Dacia Spring 26kWh pack and charging gear, which might be small enough to fit in the spare wheel space. I'm not seeing many crashed Springs become available for sale but I hope that will change as they get older. The Spring pack is 262.8v NMC and relatively compact, unlike say an old Leaf pack. Being a lower voltage it might be a drop in for the NiMH pack without inverter changes, although it's possible that a higher voltage pack might be acceptable with or without inverter changes, which opens options up a bit.
Currently working on translating the Japanese workshop manual CD and looking for a car, so progress likely to be limited until I find one. Very interested in any progress you manage to make, please keep me posted.
If you are removing the engine you might be able to do that by spoofing CAN messages at the hybrid ECU - from that PriusChat thread it seems like the engine side of things is fairly self contained and the hybrid ECU is the real boss. Effectively the engine is just another torque input into the transaxle, but if the engine were to be missing I don't think that would be a big problem. You would need to keep the transaxle as that's where MG1 and MG2 live.
(I'm new here and not sure if I'm allowed to post links yet, but I can dig them up once I have a bit of forum reputation)
I currently own a Gen2 Prius and a Yaris Hybrid (Euro version of the Prius C, similar hybrid as the Gen3 Prius) and I've been CAN sniffing with an OBDLink-SX USB cable I happened to have (speaks ELM327 protocol but at 2Mbps, unlike the ELM327 clone dongles), the Linux SocketCAN stack and SavvyCAN. In the Gen2 there's only one canbus and then battery ECU sits at the end of it, so it's all accessible from the OBD port. I can see battery ECU messages about SoC etc. I also have a clone Mini-VCI cable for TechStream but I couldn't convince Linux CAN to talk to it - possibly the fakes work different to the real thing.
On PriusChat there are a few folks who have made replacements for the battery ECU (Battery Support Unit or BSU) so an alternative battery can be fitted and generating the same CAN messages. That's stage 1 of my plan. Also there is somebody who put a man in the middle between the hybrid ECU and the engine ECU and could tell the engine to shut off and run the car in EV mode up to 70mph. On the Gen3 they say that's harder because that function is integrated into the inverter, although there appears to still be an engine ECU so maybe that can be tapped. Unfortunately none of those projects are open source that I can see.
As I don't have an Alphard yet I don't have good ideas about packaging, but I'm looking at the Dacia Spring 26kWh pack and charging gear, which might be small enough to fit in the spare wheel space. I'm not seeing many crashed Springs become available for sale but I hope that will change as they get older. The Spring pack is 262.8v NMC and relatively compact, unlike say an old Leaf pack. Being a lower voltage it might be a drop in for the NiMH pack without inverter changes, although it's possible that a higher voltage pack might be acceptable with or without inverter changes, which opens options up a bit.
Currently working on translating the Japanese workshop manual CD and looking for a car, so progress likely to be limited until I find one. Very interested in any progress you manage to make, please keep me posted.
If you are removing the engine you might be able to do that by spoofing CAN messages at the hybrid ECU - from that PriusChat thread it seems like the engine side of things is fairly self contained and the hybrid ECU is the real boss. Effectively the engine is just another torque input into the transaxle, but if the engine were to be missing I don't think that would be a big problem. You would need to keep the transaxle as that's where MG1 and MG2 live.
(I'm new here and not sure if I'm allowed to post links yet, but I can dig them up once I have a bit of forum reputation)
Re: Toyota Alphard ATH20W Hybrid to Electric.
I found a forum post with pictures of the inverter. The G92A0-28010/28011/28012 fits the Estima starting with the 28010 in 2006, then the 28011 came along in 2008 and the 28012 in 2012. Since the hybrid Alphard/Vellfire was only released in 2011 it only got the 28011 and 28012 versions. According to Amayama, the 28011 and 28012 are a recommended substitute, ie they will retrofit in older cars. That post says it's very similar to the Gen3 Prius but with an additional inverter output for the rear motor.
Toyota Estima Inverter Teardown & Inspection
Toyota Estima Inverter Teardown & Inspection